Like Om 'spanked' Pharoah once, so will do it again?...
If this colt is anything like his father, he could be that good.
What jerk?...No more so than me, anyway!!
If you were, this conversation would have ended long ago!
Be safe in your travels!...
I see that...you demand explanations for exaggerations! :)
But I think you get it. Losing allowance races and handily beating the best in the world with the numbers to back him up proves that the grade of a race does not define the horse.
Pharoah can still run a fast fig if it's in him. With a closer like Honor Code and some cheap speed up front - things he's never had to deal with - he can run a big one!
You do the same. Was hoping for a Dortmund/Kentuckian match up this weekend. But that looks like a no-go. I'll prep myself mentally not to expect much for the rest of the year. After finally believing that Shared Belief won't be back til next year, I can handle this!
Well, unless you consider Pharoah's 2-win 1-loss 2yo season as stellar, he too will have had only one great season. Another horse I really would have liked to see race more was Candy Ride. Who knows, he have may have been just as good as Ghostzapper.
No, more upstate NY and will pass thru Ky on the way back. So you will be at the BC? I think Moreno is probably his most accomplished one. Yeah, I guess you could say so. Judy would have to be his best daughter as well.
That's the point Beyer made about Shared Belief in that article I sent you a while back. Although his highest is 115 right now, he thinks he could hit the 130's with the right race setup. It's not just whether they are under wraps. He got 'rapped' pretty good in the Derby, but that didn't make a difference in the figure. If the Belmont strip was playing slow and he won under wraps like he did in the same time he would have gotten a much higher number. But all the races were fast that day.
Nevermind, you just don't get what I'm saying. Poor graded fields yield winners the same as good ones. That does not make all graded winners equal. Let's just leave it at that.
Pharoah has already proven himself consistent so far, at least to me. Your idea of consistency regarding Ghostzapper is why I said you must not find him to be inconsistent also. And I agreed with his stamina also.
As I said, Ghostzapper, as you already know, had physical issues, the reason he was so lightly raced. While you are still looking at Graded races as an end all to how good a horse is, his figures were as good and better than Pharoah's as a 2yo and 3yo. No, he was not as durable as Pharoah. But I would like to see Pharoah run as fast as he did and not have issues.
Comparing times from one race to another on the same day can prove inaccurate because of changing conditions, doing so across decades is pointless. And this is exactly the same thing I say every time Pharoah's Belmont time comes up. How relevant is it that he ran the 2nd fastest Belmont when no consideration is given to the track conditions others raced on? But again, when it comes to his slow time in the Preakness, suddenly the track condition becomes a factor.
Speed figures take more into consideration. Although Beyer's are not conclusive, I've never seen them 5-10 points different than all others at worst. When they are all in about the same range, it leaves little doubt.
Looking forward to Sea The Stars colt Quasillo in the German Derby this weekend. Check him out if you haven't yet. Both him and Golden Horn are also pointing to the Arc. Will be a great race!
I love the way two race callers switch off at different points in the race!
Would it make more sense to you if I said allowance company? The point is, no G1 race is composed entirely of G1winning horses. So to use the race designation as a means of implying a high quality field does not do much for one's credibility either.
You will not find any of those Chrome posts unless you go back to last year's Preakness. Reality has a way of changing people's perception. I see this year as not being much different.
However you choose to view Ghostzapper's pp's is your choice. As I've said multiple times, you make a distinction between great and all-time great. I do not.
So you really think being injured shows a lack of consistency? You might want to look up the meaning of the word and how it applies to horse racing. If losing a race means a horse is not consistent then only perfect records need apply for the designation of greatness. Might as well count Pharoah out because of his maiden flop while you're at it.
However you slice it, he will still have as many starts as Pharoah - who will likely never come close to breaking a track record or a speed figure even resembling that of a great horse. At least he has stamina going for him...1 out of 3 ain't bad!...
In both your posts you compared Ghostzapper to Ruffian. When I simply said that he was the last greatest horse to run. No two horse will have the exact same race records to compare. So that is clearly not the wisest way to determine a great horse. That is what I was pointing out as being meaningless stats. I would not begin to make an actual comparison of the two. But like I said, when a horse develops is one thing. The limits they reach is quite another. Ruffian would by far kick Ghostzapper's butt up and down the track as 2yo's. But would she have done so as a 4 or 5yo. She was great at 2 & 3, Ghostzapper at 4 & 5. Like I said, it's not about who raced more or had more G1 wins, but the Greatness that they showed - speed, stamina, and consistency. Like Secretariat, one can only imagine what she would have been like had she lived.
Speaking of Adena, will be passing thru to stop and visit him in July!
BTW...thanks for the Ehalt laugh!...
I also thought it was interesting that Count Fleet, who some have referred to as one of the 'lesser' TC winners, was estimated by Beyer to have run a speed figure in the range of 150 before he retired at three. I'd like to see Pharoah get past his high of 105 before he bows out.
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